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Cold War (1950-1974)
Discuss the aircraft modeling subjects during the Cold War period.
Hosted by Tim Hatton
Size of markings on F-4B Phantom
jonvan
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Massachusetts, United States
Joined: August 23, 2015
KitMaker: 157 posts
AeroScale: 109 posts
Posted: Saturday, September 19, 2015 - 08:55 PM UTC
Hello, I am currently working on an F-4B Phantom, the old Revell 1/72 kit, VF-84 Jolly Rogers from their Vietnam cruise. I need stars and NAVY for the fuselage and wings but am uncertain of the size. I know the fuselage star was smaller than the wing star but were they 24, 36, 48, or 60 inch? Also what was the size of the NAVY letters? I have the paint , gray over white done, just need to do the burner cans, metallic area on tail and nose. Here is where I am at. Thanks---John
Thearmorer
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Alabama, United States
Joined: June 17, 2014
KitMaker: 121 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Saturday, September 19, 2015 - 11:36 PM UTC
John,
Got some info for you on the National Markings for your F4B. I've go an old Microscale F4B decal sheet that calls for the wing markings as being 48 inch; and the fuselage markings as 32 inch. But I'm not sure as to how they are making their measurements since neither dimension matches the official USN standards. I was able to dig up an old Testors decal sheet and actually measured what their version had for a Marine RF4B which came out at 30 inch for both wing and fuselage. The official specifications for that time period (mid 1960's) states: the insignia were to be between 10 inch min. to 60 inch max; in 5 inch increments from 10-40 inches and 10 inch increments from 40 to 60 inches. In 1972 the standard was changed to a maximum of 40 inches and a minimum of 10 inches, 5 inch increments remained the same. The following diagram shows where the diameter measurements were taken:



With dimension "D" being the stated size.

As for the "NAVY" lettering, the Microscale sheet scales out at 24 inches which sounds about right. The assigned ship names scale out to 8 inches. As a check, the official standard for the wing insignia was: "The diameter chosen was to be the standard size closest to, but does not exceed fifty percent of the distance between the leading edge of the wing and the leading edge of the aileron cutout at the point of application." The above is from John Elliott's "Official Monogram US Navy & Marine Corps Aircraft Color Guide", Vol. 4, 1960-1993. Seems like a lot of verbage, but what your dealing with is bureaucracy in action. Hope this helps.
jonvan
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Massachusetts, United States
Joined: August 23, 2015
KitMaker: 157 posts
AeroScale: 109 posts
Posted: Sunday, September 20, 2015 - 01:01 AM UTC
Thanks, the Superscale decals are---Fuselage stars 32 inches, Wing stars 60 inches and NAVY on rear fuselage 32 inches tall.
I measure the stars by the roundel, in 1/72 scale a .83 inch roundel is 60 inches in "real size". Not sure who is really right, Superscale or The NAVY. Just for giggles and chits I checked out my CAM sheet for F-4B,J,N,S and it is what you said. 48 inch for wing star, 32 inch for fuselage star and 24 inch for NAVY on fuselage.Thanks---John
Thearmorer
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Alabama, United States
Joined: June 17, 2014
KitMaker: 121 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Sunday, September 20, 2015 - 02:06 AM UTC
John,
i laid my trusty Murphy's rule on the wings of an old Monogram and equally old Fujimi F4 kit and came up with a measured scale distance of between 7 and 8 feet between aileron and leading edge. That would put your "D" distance either 40 or 45 inches. (largest standard size less the 1/2 the distance)



It looks like the insignia is pretty well centered on the wingtip hinge. My suggestion is, if you've got a choice, just eyeball it and go with which looks best. And in this shot the fuselage insignia does look smaller than the wing one. Simply amazing how difficult it is to find a good top down/bottom up shot of something as common as the F4 was in the 1960's. Good luck in any event.
DR