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Advice needed: Building a modern Helicopter
helkaissy
#376
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Al Qahirah, Egypt / لعربية
Joined: October 06, 2013
KitMaker: 243 posts
AeroScale: 37 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 25, 2013 - 10:48 PM UTC
Hello to all Aeroscale members,

I am an Egyptian modeler, I have been modeling for just one year now and have mainly done armored vehicles and tanks and dioramas. Now as part of my next diorama I am about to build the "Apache AH64D longbow" and this will be my first helicopter build (i have honestly been afraid to touch this kit for some time) and I have some questions so I thought to seek the advice of the more experienced plane modelers here:

1- My first question is regarding the painting of the Apache, since the color used will be dark olive green and it is quite a dark tone, I have selected the Tamiya XF57 color for it, here is how it looks in reality:

and this is the Tamiya color selected:

does it make sense to make preshading in that case? for example if I use black preshading will it really show from behind that color? how do I make sure the model doesn't come out too single tone if the dominant color is this green? do I need to apply a wash after the base color? what color of wash should I use?

2- my Second question is since the Apache is a rather modern and expensive helicopter and is quite well preserved by most armies and is usually in crisp condition, does it make sense in this case to apply some weathering to it? and if yes what type of weathering do you suggest? chiping, dust, mud, sand?

3- Are there any tutorials somewhere about specifically building helicopters? I tried looking but couldn't find any

Sorry for so many questions but this is my first try and its quite a large and expensive kit at 1/35 scale and I want to get it right.

Thanks in Advance

Hussein
helkaissy
#376
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Al Qahirah, Egypt / لعربية
Joined: October 06, 2013
KitMaker: 243 posts
AeroScale: 37 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 25, 2013 - 10:51 PM UTC
Another question:
As you realize from the photos the XF51 color is somewhat lighter than the color in the photo so I am tempted to add some black to it to adjust the tone. but again this will affect the preshading issue. I am also considering making the entire primer coat black and applying the XF51 as it is hoping that the base coat will darken it to reach this final color tone but in this case for sure there will be no preshading at all.
helkaissy
#376
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Al Qahirah, Egypt / لعربية
Joined: October 06, 2013
KitMaker: 243 posts
AeroScale: 37 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 25, 2013 - 10:55 PM UTC
Another XF51 tone image, is it the right color for this project?
Joel_W
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New York, United States
Joined: December 04, 2010
KitMaker: 9,436 posts
AeroScale: 7,295 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 26, 2013 - 03:42 AM UTC
While I don't build helicopters, the issue of preshading aircraft is basically the same. The darker the base color, the less preshading will show through, but that's what you want. Many times the preshading looks unrealistic as it's too pronounced. You really just want it to look like shadows or fading of the center of panels. I would go with a blackish brown color. Light, thin coats of the case color slowly built up. Let dry every so often, and see what the preshading looks like compared to the base color coverage.

The Tamiya color is somewhat darker then the color of the top. When applied to the model and flat coated, it will dry a shade or two darker.

All aircraft that is out in the field will show some signs of weathering. Dust, sand, mud, oil, grease,etc. rather then paint fading, or excess paint chipping if any at all.

You can do a few google searches for tutorials. You Tube seems to have some on every topic you can think of. Your armor modeling skills are more then enough to build a OOB Helicopter. Only difference is how you work with the clear parts.

Joel
drabslab
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European Union
Joined: September 28, 2004
KitMaker: 2,149 posts
AeroScale: 1,581 posts
Posted: Friday, December 27, 2013 - 03:20 AM UTC
I think that the official apache colour is FS 34031.

The only modelling brand having this in their range is Model Master: number 2024 or number 4723.

Weathering is not only a matter of good or bad maintenance but also of the conditions that the aircraft is flying under. A apache used for training safely in the states may look a lot better than another one suffering desserts in Afghanistan.
raypalmer
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Ontario, Canada
Joined: March 29, 2010
KitMaker: 1,151 posts
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Posted: Friday, December 27, 2013 - 06:07 AM UTC
I think chipping would be minimal. Definitely would be dusty/grimy though returning from flight (they tend to fly very low). But I imagine they are cleaned early and often.

I'd base coat black.
helkaissy
#376
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Al Qahirah, Egypt / لعربية
Joined: October 06, 2013
KitMaker: 243 posts
AeroScale: 37 posts
Posted: Friday, December 27, 2013 - 06:58 AM UTC
Well so far here are my ideas:
Preshading with a very dark brown as Joel suggested, I would preshade the apache seem lines and probably preshade the entire bottom of the body and tail as it would be darker in shade
Can anyone help by telling me which parts in your opinion should be chipped? And also regarding the weathering I think light dust on the body and dark sand on the wheels, still I am confused where to apply the weathering? Which areas would usually collect dust in a helicopter?
I tried to find photos of weathered apache but all the photos I found are neat and clean. Can you help me with some photos
Thanks
Hussein
Jessie_C
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British Columbia, Canada
Joined: September 03, 2009
KitMaker: 6,702 posts
AeroScale: 5,998 posts
Posted: Friday, December 27, 2013 - 07:44 AM UTC
Here's a fairly well-weathered Apache. Even though it's been kept pretty clean, note how the paint is discoloured at the panel joints. and mottled by spot repair here and there. Note the small scuffs and scratches here and there. Chipping is at a minimum but that's because the ground crews touch it up right away. What chipping there is seems to be confined to screws and edges of frequently removed panels. Faded and blotchy are the words which describe what you want to achieve.
helkaissy
#376
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Al Qahirah, Egypt / لعربية
Joined: October 06, 2013
KitMaker: 243 posts
AeroScale: 37 posts
Posted: Friday, December 27, 2013 - 08:37 AM UTC
thanks Jessica these are indeed very useful photos
They will help me a lot
I have noticed that Apaches are usually stained a lot, the matt color seems to attract a lot of oil spots here and there.
These photos will be the guidelines for my weathering
Thanks again