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Paint, Paint, Paint
FLAKATTAK
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England - North, United Kingdom
Joined: December 11, 2009
KitMaker: 53 posts
AeroScale: 33 posts
Posted: Friday, April 09, 2010 - 02:57 AM UTC
Hello everyone, Firstly apologies If this has been asked before. I am going to start using my airbrush now & having checked out which paint to use, I have found It quite head spinning. I did use Revell/Humbrol Enamels & am now going to use Acryllics, the paint I am leaning towards Is the MODEL MASTERS ACRYL, by Testors. I have also found a site called internethobbies.com that sell the paint In sets, like RAF set, LUFTWAFFE set, etc-etc. These sets contain all the paint needed for WW2 aircraft, which is what I will be modelling. Does anyone use this paint & can tell me If Its good for airbrushing & If It needs to be thinned & what thinners to use. A lot of questions I know, but a big thanks for your help.

Sean...
thegirl
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Alberta, Canada
Joined: January 19, 2008
KitMaker: 6,729 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 09, 2010 - 03:25 AM UTC
It all comes down to your personal choice on which brand you want to use . We all have different experiences with paint brand work best for us / methods used for applying . What works best for me might not be the best for you , but nothing wrong with trying new things to find what you are going to comfortable with .

I use Model Master Acrylics and they are an excellent paint with a very wide range of colours . For thinning I use their thinner brand for best results . Note though when thinning for airbrushing add the thinner very slowly , one drop to many can make it very frustrating . I spray it around 10 psi any thing higher and the paint starts to dry before it hit's the model . You can also use water for a thinner , rubbing alcohol , windex , wind shield washer fuild . All can be used for clean up as well . Drying time is pretty quick , but it's best to let each coat dry for 24 hours before the next one .


Tamiya are the best paints for airbrushing when it comes to acrylic's , others will disagree , but this is IMO and from experience with their product . easy to thin mixes well , drys fast . Easy to clean . You can you their brand of thinner , but it is not cheap . The paint can be thinnes with water . I haven't tried using other types of solutions for thinning . You can use water for clean up .
Only draw back is the lack of colours they have in their range . So mixing some colours will need to be done for some shades .


IPMS stockholmns.com has an excellent paint guide for all the different brands with mixing guides for colours . A valuible tool to have .
JPTRR
Staff MemberManaging Editor
RAILROAD MODELING
#051
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Tennessee, United States
Joined: December 21, 2002
KitMaker: 7,340 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 09, 2010 - 04:29 AM UTC
Hi Sean,

I use acrylics almost exclusively, mainly for health protection.

My all-round favorite is Polly Scale (by Testors) but I see you are in England, and I understand they are hard to come by over there. If you can get P.S., they are completely water friendly, and I have no problem getting fine, smooth coverage with my Aztec or Passche airbrushes. Posted on-site is a comparison of P.S. vs Tamiya and Model Master Acryl, demonstrating that P.S. did not pull off under tape,, nor scratch off with fingernails, as the other two did.

I have never used Aqueous Gunze or Valejo, though those are popular. I have used Model master but find they are not 100% water-soluable and need MM thinners. Same for Tamiya.
Siderius
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Tennessee, United States
Joined: September 20, 2005
KitMaker: 1,747 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 09, 2010 - 12:28 PM UTC
Hi there, I agree with Fred. I have used Acrylic paints exclusively for the dozen years or so I have been airbrushing. They are very easy to use and they are much healthier for you than enamels! Just don't mix them with your orange juice, might not be so good!

I have also used the Model Master Acryl and have enjoyed them, I probably prefer the Polly Scale military colors if I an get them. Hope this helps. Thin your paints with a little bit of water, that's what I do and my results speak for themselves!!!

Hope this helps. Russell
Phil_H
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New South Wales, Australia
Joined: November 10, 2005
KitMaker: 546 posts
AeroScale: 23 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 10, 2010 - 02:23 PM UTC
The key point when using acrylics of any brand is cleanliness. Your surface must be dust and oil free otherwise acrylic paints will have adhesion problems. Wash your parts before assembly/painting and wash or wipe down with isopropyl or denatured alcohol before painting.

I've not used Model Master acrylics, but I have read many accounts of MM Acrylics coming off with masking tape, so there may be some inherent adhesion issues there.

When starting out with a new brand/paint system, I'd recommend starting with the manufacturer's own proprietary thinner so that you have a point of reference as to how the paint is supposed to behave. After you become accustomed to how it works, then you may wish to explore other thinning options.

In general,acrylic paints "surface-dry" very quickly nut can take some hours to cure, during which time the paint is quite soft. Typically, Tamiya acrylics can appear dry in seconds, but actually take up to 24 hours or more to fully cure.

Note also that "acrylic" does not mean "water based", and rather, refers to the chemical composition of the binders in the paint. This means that not all acrylic paints are cross-compatible and that thinners for some brands are not compatible with others. For example, Tamiya and Gunze acrylics use an alcohol based thinner and attempting to use their thinners with a non-compatible brand like Vallejo will turn the paint into a sticky ball of goo.

While a small amount of water can be used with most acrylic paints, there is a point where too much will result in loss of adhesion and poor finish. While proprietary brand thinners can appear expensive, our models are more so. Cheap alternatives can sometimes be a false economy when they provide second-rate results. Even when using a manufacturer's proprietary thinner, for the amount used, it's often one of the lowest costs of a given project.


FLAKATTAK
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England - North, United Kingdom
Joined: December 11, 2009
KitMaker: 53 posts
AeroScale: 33 posts
Posted: Tuesday, April 13, 2010 - 10:39 PM UTC
Hi Guys, Thanks for your replies, Its appreciated very much. Until I can get Acryllic paints & I have been brush painting enamels, but I want to start & use my Airbrush, now Ive been told I will need to use thinners, Is this true??

Also because I use Revell & Humbrol Enamel paints, would I be better off buying Revell Thinners & Humbrol Thinners to be used with the same brand paint, I heard on here about Incompatibilities when using non-branded thinners & whats the mixing process for airbrushing. I have ordered some glass droppers & am I correct In thinking I need to put 3 drops paint to 1 drop thinner & for spraying the base coat a PSI of 20-25 will be ok & for closer detailed work a PSI of 10-15 will be ok??

Regards, A lot of questions I know, but I need answering because theres a lot I dont know about airbrushing.

Sean.
mtnflyer
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Alberta, Canada
Joined: March 08, 2009
KitMaker: 394 posts
AeroScale: 360 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 14, 2010 - 08:08 PM UTC
Sean

I'm a beginner static modeler myself, and was also afraid to use an airbrush in the past. Through my R/C modelling, though, I've learned some things, and now use, quickly clean, and reuse an airbrush with passion.

I'm converting to acrylics, but, have used MM enamels extensively. I thin the enamel with common paint thinners, to the consistency of milk, and have had no problems. Specific paint manufacturer thinners have proven far to expensive. I clean-up with the paint thinner and a quick squirt of toluol. This has to be used carefully, as it can be dangerous.

Further, it's important to install a water trap onto your compressor (if you use), because moisture in the air will become compressed through your apparatus, and water droplets will land on your work.

For acrylics, I use water to thin, again to the consistency of milk. No big issues so far. Window cleaner and water are acceptable cleaning mediums.

It will surprise you, how quickly you'll become comfortable with the airbrush. After-all, it is only a fancy brush.

If I was you, I would use your nice glass droppers for adding thinners only, and use a swizzle stick or toothpick to add drops of color. Glass droppers are way to hard to clean.

Guy
FLAKATTAK
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England - North, United Kingdom
Joined: December 11, 2009
KitMaker: 53 posts
AeroScale: 33 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 15, 2010 - 01:56 AM UTC
Hi Guy, thanks for your reply. If you can tell me what the mixing process should be, you know 1 drop thinner to 3 drops paint etc-etc or Is It just until you get a milky consistency & If you can help me on the PSI. I was thinking 20-25PSI for the base coat & 10-15PSI for the more close detail work, also I will be using Tamiyas light grey Primer In a spray can, Is this ok to use??

Regards & thanks.
Sean.
mtnflyer
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Alberta, Canada
Joined: March 08, 2009
KitMaker: 394 posts
AeroScale: 360 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 15, 2010 - 07:55 AM UTC
Hi

I always use the Tamiya Grey Primer or Mr Surfacer 1000 Aerosol. Both are excellent in my opinion.

As far as mixing goes, I always mix a little paint in a separate color cup, adding drops of thinner until the consistency of milk is achieved. Milk doesn't drip heavy, and it can be quite difficult to drip from a stick. Its quite thin. Mix only what you need, because it does not do well if saved.

I use a Badger 200 single action, which is highly adjustable as per the amount of color displaced. No idea what my portable Badger compressor puts out for pressure, other than its not much.

Someone may well correct me, because I'm just a beginner myself. It all seems to be working for me, though, without grief.

Guy
Badjong
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Philippines
Joined: January 12, 2011
KitMaker: 10 posts
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Posted: Friday, January 14, 2011 - 04:58 PM UTC

Quoted Text

IPMS stockholmns.com has an excellent paint guide for all the different brands with mixing guides for colours . A valuible tool to have .




Hi is it ok if you put the link from IPMS Stockholm? Thanks. More Power!
Tomcat31
#042
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England - North East, United Kingdom
Joined: November 18, 2006
KitMaker: 2,828 posts
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Posted: Saturday, January 15, 2011 - 08:47 AM UTC
Here you go

IPMS Stockholm, Modellers Helpdesk
drabslab
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European Union
Joined: September 28, 2004
KitMaker: 2,149 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, January 18, 2011 - 08:58 AM UTC
I grew up with Humbrol enamel.

a few years ago a LHS poitned me towards Modelmaster enamel.

Since that day I have been experimenting with modelmaster acryl and enamel, revell enamel and tamiya acryl.

Still, and despite all health issues, modelmaster enamel works best forme. Very good airbrush results.

What I find annoying about paint is that model manufacturers and/or paintmanufacturers do not stcik to a single standard for numbering the paint.

The once popular federal standard is a good system but not used systematically


robtmelvin
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Kentucky, United States
Joined: October 05, 2010
KitMaker: 205 posts
AeroScale: 18 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 12:27 AM UTC
Coming from a ship modeling background I've used White Ensign Colourcoats enamels for some time. Great range of colors specific to WW 2, U.S. Navy, U.S. A.A.F., R.A.F., Luftwaffe, etc.. Great coverage and thins well with Testor's Enamel Thinner. Only drawback is that certain colors have been hard to come by lately due to supply problems with the pigments, apparently. Several vendors here in the U.S., with MidTennHobbies.com being among the best I've found, or you can order directly from White Ensign Models. For primer I use Alclad II grey primer. Pre-mixed for airbrush. I'd strongly suggest using a respirator for either product, though, since they produce some pretty nasty fumes.

Bob